Jonathan Leary

Stacy Shoemaker Rauen: Hi, I’m here with Jonathan Leary. Jonathan, thanks so much for joining me today. How are you?

Jonathan Leary: Amazing. Thank you for having me.

SSR: Yeah, I’m excited. Okay, so let’s dive in. Where did you grow up?

JL: I grew up in Rhode Island. Have you been to Rhode Island before?

SSR: Yes, I’ve been.

JL: So I grew up in a small little town about 10 minutes outside of Providence.

SSR: I love it. What were you like as a kid?

JL: I was always active, always outgoing, always had big dreams, and I always worked really hard.

SSR: You’re one of those. Love it. Was there any hint this, what you do now, being in the wellness hospitality space, was there any hint of that or were you surrounded by any early influences that would have helped shape you to today?

JL: For some reason, I always knew that I wanted to be a doctor, and I always knew that I wanted to move to L.A. I think I was telling my mom at five or six that I was like, “I’m going to move to L.A.” And she thought it was so funny because I’d never visited until I actually moved there. But obviously my way of how I went about helping people changed as I experienced things in life, but the goal was to always be a doctor.

SSR: Got it. So where did you go to school to become a doctor?

JL: Yeah, so I did my undergrad at University of Rhode Island and I did my doctorate at Southern California University.

SSR: Awesome. And what kind of doctor did you want to be? Did that change over the years?

JL: Yeah, so I wanted to go be a traditional medical doctor. During that, I was everything from plastic surgeon to dermatologist. I was looking at exploring everything, but during my undergrad and studying pre-med, you have to volunteer and shadow a lot in the hospital setting. And I remember just thinking after doing it so many times, is this really what I want to do? It wasn’t how I imagined helping people, but also working in a hospital setting was crazy and chaotic and wild, and I just saw the stress on the patients, but also the stress on the doctors. And I remember just thinking the doctors aren’t sleeping. They’re away from their families. Their health is being compromised by their schedules and the amount of stress. And I was like, maybe I just need to create my own type of practice.

And that’s when I knew that I wanted to start working on Remedy Place. And I was like, what’s the fastest way that I could build this dream practice? And I found out that chiropractors in the state of California are primary care physicians and they can treat and diagnose anything. They just can’t prescribe meds or puncture the skin, perform surgery. So I was like, amazing. I didn’t know anything about alternative medicine, I didn’t know anything about chiropractic, but then I entered the program. So I knew that by the end of it I would have my scope and that I could build Remedy. And then through those years of school, I really started to see the power of alternative medicine and the science behind it and how impactful it actually was, which was contrary to everything that I was hearing or what I was told.

SSR: Interesting. You got your degree in kinesiology, right, in chiropractic medicine?

JL: I did my undergrad, I did pre-med through kinesiology, and I did my doctorate in chiropractic medicine.

SSR: Okay. And through that, did that just solidify what you thought? And then let’s go to how did you take that and what was the vision for Remedy Place?

JL: Yeah, listen, I was really specializing in sports medicine, so I was like, all right, who’s going to be the type of demographic that is really going to care about their health the most? I realized that no one can just make you healthy. The patient has to put in more of the work than the doctor. The doctor’s job is to educate, provide the tools, maybe help facilitate things faster. And I was just drawn to athletes because I was like, they’ll get it and they’ll put in the work. But I think at first, Remedy was supposed to just be this beautiful space with hospitality standards that had an experience built in.

And every time that I was in different practices or working under different doctors or doing rotations, I was introduced to all of these technologies from hyperbaric to red light to almost everything that we have in the space. And I was like, wow, why doesn’t everyone use these things? It’s crazy that we just wait until things are broken before we start using them. And I graduated, I had this 158 page binder, and I just thought if you had a good business plan, you got a business loan. And I worked on it for the entire doctorate program and I went to Wells Fargo and the woman laughed at me and she’s like, “Sir, you have no money and all this student loan debt. How am I supposed to give you a loan?” And I’m like, “What do you mean? That’s why I need a loan.”

So then I pivoted and I went into private practice for five years. It was a concierge practice, but that was the best thing that ever happened to me because I got to listen for five more years. I got to listen to patients, see what worked, see what didn’t work, what were they willing to do, what were they not willing to do, common lifestyle stressors, habits, routines, and just hearing, what are the biggest complaints or the areas of improvements that I kept hearing from all of my patients? And the number one complaint that I heard for five years was, “Dr. Leary, I feel incredible, and now that you’ve made me implement all of these different lifestyle changes to fix the root cause and to get me healthy, you’re really ruining my social life and now I can’t have any fun.” And I remember being like, “Why is being healthy so isolating and why do we have to stop doing all the social things that we do?”

And that’s when I knew that Remedy Place had to add the social component. I’m like, all right, well, each thing that you’re going to do to take care of yourself, why not be able to do that with other people? Because if you think about a date or an after work hangout or your birthday, there’s no reason why you have to do that at a restaurant or over food or over drinks. You could do it over anything. And that was really foreign at that time and I would say we created social wellness club or social self-care, all these words that we trademarked. And I remember people would be like, “Jon, that’s the most L.A. thing. That’s not going to work anywhere.” And now the trends are all over the world. And it’s so cool to see not only the awareness, but just the shift in people’s behaviors and how fast it’s happening.

SSR: Yeah, I mean, it’s been amazing just to see over the last five years how much, and not to go back to the pandemic, but I do think it was happening before that, and then I think COVID when people were stuck in their homes and realized what things affect their bodies, especially with COVID, I think that definitely accelerated people being like, “Okay, let me rethink this a bit.” What do you think about that? And do you agree?

JL: Yeah, I think COVID was the light switch that went on in people’s head to realize that if you’re not healthy, there’s not a magical thing that can save you. And I think we saw a lot of tragedy and I think that shifted the awareness around the things that make you feel better and the importance of health. But the bigger problem it caused was the isolation problem and the isolated humanity. And we know that human connection is one of the most important things for our health. And I would never say that 10 years ago because, as an alternative medicine doctor, if I said human connection is the most important thing for your health, that would’ve been the most woo-woo thing I could have ever said. But now from Harvard studies, the studies on Blue Zones, we know that the common denominator of longevity is community and our relationships. And it’s exciting to see that the science is catching up to what a lot of people have already known for a long time that just couldn’t be explained by science, but that shift is real and it’s really happening.

SSR: So you had this idea for Remedy Place. First, what was the name? Was that always the name or is that something you came upon?

JL: Yeah, honestly, I’m being honest, I don’t know if I ever said this publicly, it was called Remedy House and I couldn’t get it trademarked. So last minute change with a friend’s help, I transitioned it to Remedy Place.

SSR: And I think I even like it better than house.

JL: For sure, for sure. I think I was so inspired and motivated by Soho House that I was just like, oh, I’m just going to do Soho House, but wellness. And that was one of my inspirations. So I’m happy it wasn’t called Remedy House because then it would’ve been too much.

SSR: Yeah. Well, I guess that’s a good point. What were your inspirations? I mean, obviously, you were playing in a different field and you wanted to do something different, but once you knew that you wanted the connection and you wanted a place for people to hang out, how did the initial 150 something page idea evolve, I guess, and then what did you ultimately want to create with Remedy Place?

JL: Yeah, I was always inspired by companies that did something unique and innovative and paved the way. What Equinox did for Luxury Fitness was amazing, and their creative and their campaigns were always so out there and so different and pushing the boundaries. And I loved that. What Soho House did for private members clubs. Soho House made private members clubs what member private members clubs are, to see companies like Restoration Hardware, which is a furniture company, but turned into so much more, into a lifestyle brand and see how cool that someone could just take these concepts and grow them into something that is so much bigger and greater. So I was always inspired by the stories and the ability to be able to do that, and to dream really big.

But with Remedy, it was always really problem, solution. I would hear the problems from patients and I would document it and then be like, “All right, what’s the easiest solution here?” And then the design, I never knew anything about design, but I had a very clear vision of what I wanted Remedy to look like. And I remember when we were working with the design team and the architect, I’m like, “All right, here’s what I want. Here’s the plan.” I was sketching things out to talking about the flows to the colors, the material, like everything. And they’re like, “You can’t really do that.” I was like, “What do you mean?” They’re like, “It’s a wellness space and you can’t do black.” And I’m like, “I want to be the exact opposite of a clinic. We have to do black and dark.” I was pushed back on each room like, “That’s going to be too much, That’s going to be too much.” And I was like, “Guys, this is how I see it and we just have to do it.”

And then we started winning all of these global design awards. And I think what Remedy is really known for partially is really our design of the clubs. And that’s something that I’m so proud of because I’m like, once again, it’s really just thinking about design in a different way. I think when I’ve spoken at design conferences or hear designers speak, it’s always about how you want the client or the person to feel in the space, where I’ve always talked about how I want the environment to shift the physiology of the human in the space. And I think it’s really interesting to know the impact of environment on our health. And there’s so many things that you can manipulate to manipulate senses to positively enhance the human so they don’t even have to be doing anything to be enhanced.

And that’s what I’ve now grown a really strong passion for, is I’m not a traditional designer. I didn’t go to school to be a designer, but I just keep thinking of more and more ways of how to enhance the human in the space. But then, also, I don’t know, when I walk into some of these buildings when we’re about to sign these leases, I just know that it’s the right space when I walk in. I can just see what it’s supposed to be. And now we’re four clubs in and the designs keep getting more and more unique and special. And that gets me excited because I’m like, I could really mess this up if I do it wrong. I think there’s a point of just having to trust your gut and not one design is a match for all people, and I think that’s okay. But I think, if things are done intentionally and there’s so much thought and effort that go into every detail, I think people feel that whether it’s their design style or not.

SSR: Yeah, 100%. And how did you figure out who to work with on the design since, obviously, you had to hire somebody, since that wasn’t your expertise? But how did you pick the designer and have you worked with the same person over the last few spaces or do you switched that up?

JL: So the first two, we used a company called Bells and Whistles. They’re amazing. We first picked them because I was like, I don’t want to pick anyone that’s done anything in the health and wellness space. Because I know that even no matter how much we want to push, there’s going to be inherent things that are going to be biased based on other projects. And I’m like, I just want them to be inspired by hotels and restaurants. So that’s why we selected them and they were absolutely amazing and so talented and I really appreciate them. And then after that, our contractor for Soho, his wife did the plans for us, but we handled the design, and I’m not sitting there doing the elevation drawings or the architectural drawings, but eventually we ended up bringing that between agencies with our architect and then we had an in-house person that was helping with all the millwork drawings and everything. But yeah, it slowly transitioned to, I learned a lot the first couple and each one I’m hoping to learn and be better and better. But it’s been a fun journey.

SSR: Yeah. Well, first let’s go back to Bells and Whistles. Just FYI, they were one of our Wave of the Future honorees, which is people on our radar 15 years ago. They’re brilliant.

JL: They’re so good.

SSR: They’re so good. But what have you loved learning about the process, the design process since that was something new to you? Is there one part that you liked the most? Is it finding that building and walking in and being able to visualize it? Is it seeing the end result and watching how people use the space?

JL: I think my favorite part is just conceptualization, to be able to, like you said, go in the space, sit there, think about the flow first. Once you get the flow, sketching out each room of, all right, what’s going to be the focal point here? What’s going to be the unique thing that everyone’s going to talk about? Where do you want the special moments to be? And then I think the fun part after that is for me to actually learn, meet with these lighting designers and companies and learn about how lighting works, learn from millwork designers. There’s so many intricacies that go into design that I didn’t actually even know how crazy and in depth all of these things are. And I just want to be a sponge and learn as much as possible. So I think the funnest part for me is, one, building out the concept and figuring out the flow and, what are the focal points in each room?

And then secondarily, just learning, learning each thing. Even down to the construction because it’s an important tool in life, I think, to understand how things are built. And I think the more that you understand, the more you can appreciate. So when I’m going to hotels or traveling, the things that I’m able to catch in the architecture of the building or the design of whatever room, you start to understand that your awareness around all the special things really stand out. And then that helps me be inspired. Whether it’s a vacation or I’m on a work trip, I might be inspired by a shape or I might be inspired by one finish on a wall or the way that they lit up the hallway. There’s always something. And I just always take pictures of things I’m inspired by.

And then I figure out, I have a folder for each club of, all right, what in here could I use as inspiration to create our version? Or if that lighting was in a hallway, could I do that lighting over an ice bath? There’s always these things that it’s fun. And I think what I realized is there’s not really a right or wrong thing. There are rules, but sometimes it’s fun to break those design rules and do things that you’re not supposed to do and see if it works.

SSR: Yeah, true. And I guess, too, my other question is, so you had the original idea and you opened your first one. Now you just mentioned you have four. How have you evolved? There’s always new things happening in wellness and new ideas and new remedies. How have you evolved that one through four? And are there certain things that are essential to each space that you know are deal breakers, that you have to have X?

JL: Yeah. I think everything’s there because I know that it works. These aren’t things that just people are pitching me of this new fancy technology. Our technology, the modality like a hyperbaric or a red light or an ice bath, they’ve stayed the same. Maybe the technology of it being better or more enhanced is the same. But for me, I want everyone to know that anything that’s in Remedy is there because we know firsthand that it works and that everything’s been there for 10 years or something. If it were tested on patients and myself for over 10 years, something like that was new that was added to Soho and then in Boston was we have an AI robotic massage. Have I tested an AI robotic massage for 10 years? No, but I know I’ve tested massage for 10 years. So I think there’s ways there that maybe how it’s delivered or how the guest experiences it is different, but the modality is the same.

And for me, the evolution is how to make it more and more social because it isn’t just parties of two that want to come in. Sometimes it’s parties of 10 that want to come in. And initially our clubs weren’t designed to have reservations of 10. And also events have become a major part for our business where companies don’t only want to host parties over a dinner or an open bar. They want it at a social wellness club and they want it to be experiential and they want it to be healthy and different. So now that we know that our event business is becoming a major part of our business, I think it’s exciting to see also how we’re using the clubs for event spaces and making sure that we’re keeping that in mind as the clubs evolve.

SSR: Right. And what does that mean for space planning? Because you can’t do all events around ice baths, right? You need other spaces to let them hang out and be together.

JL: And I think it’s important. Only one small portion of our clubs are ice baths. We offer so much more. Some people don’t know. Some people are like, “Oh my god, you do saunas an ice bath?” I’m like, “Yeah, and here’s 15 other things.” But it is funny because, in the beginning, we were the first place to turn ice baths into a class format in a commercial setting and now it’s a standard or a staple and all of these new places open up. But we blew up on social media and we had hundreds of millions of views from our ice bath classes. So in the beginning everyone was like, “Oh, you’re just that ice bath company.” And I’m like, “No, no, no, no, no. We have so much more than that.” So sometimes when people are listening, it’s always either the ice bath Sauna company or they think that we’re a private members club. And I’m like, “We’re not a private club.” I think the word club makes people think that they can’t come. And I’m like, “No, our whole thing is we’ll never be a private members club because I’d never want to cut anyone out because our vision and mission is too big.”

SSR: Yeah, that’s really interesting. Okay, so tell us all the things that you do then. I guess break it down. Besides ice baths and saunas, what are some of the other major things that you have? And then let’s talk about your non-membership model too. I think that’s interesting.

JL: So we have your chiropractor that does chiro, physio, and Chinese medicine all in one. We have our acupuncturist that does acupuncture and cupping. We have naturopathic doctors that do full functional medicine. They also do our vitamin IVs, vitamin injections, and then occasionally we offer peptides where necessary. Then we have all of these testing that we call Meridian. It’s in our assessment suite where we capture up to 600 biomarkers from VO2 max testing to resting metabolic rate, to measuring the range of motion of every joint, stability, cognitive function, memory, all of these different tests, down to even doing your blood work to vitamins that are made in Switzerland that are specifically to you. And then we retest your blood work every quarter to show you that you’re actually absorbing your vitamins.

And then we have everything from hyperbaric chambers. We have these Remedy rollers, which are these automatic foam rolling devices with red light technology. We have red light. We have lymphatic. We have cryo. We have our AI robotic massage. We have private sauna suites. We have contrast suites. We have breath work ice bath studios. And then some of our clubs have atriums that we hold classes in, whether it’s breath work, sound bath, meditation. In Boston, we actually opened up doing yoga and floor Pilates for groups of 10. And that’s a new thing that we’re exploring. Because my background with working with people that were coming to me because they were in pain, a lot of people are getting injured from their workouts now, which your workout should fix the body, not break it.

And what would happen is we’d fix the patient and then they would go do their workouts again and then get broken again. And I’m like, I do think that a personal trainer should have the same schooling as a physical therapist because the body is really the intricate and it’s really complex and if you know how to get someone to move their body, you can do a lot, especially with anyone that’s in pain or has injuries. And I think I was like, you know what? We’re never going to be a gym, but maybe we have these programs that we oversee to make sure that they’re the safest movements. That way people can get their movement in while us knowing that it’s safe.

SSR: Interesting. So when people came to you broken, how do you take that and help? Let me start that over. Talk to a little bit about, before all this, what you need before you get broken? Because I feel like a lot of people go to chiropractor, go to acupuncture, myself included, I have hurt my shoulder and now I go to a chiropractor, now I go to acupuncture, but there’s so much more now about preventative than after. So is that also part of what Remedy can offer?

JL: For sure. Our whole thing is, obviously, prevention is so important because we don’t want to get sick, but I think we’ve also gotten so sick in the U.S. that the goal of being healthy is to not be sick. And I’m like, whoa, whoa, whoa. Healthy is just not the absence of illness. Healthy is so much more than that. But yes, the goal of being healthy is primarily in the state that we’re in to make sure we don’t get sick. But then there’s the whole other half that the healthier you are, the more successful you’re going to be with everything that you’re trying to accomplish in life. Whether it’s achieving happiness or creativity or work, it doesn’t really matter.

But when you’re healthier, you perform better and you do better and you think clearer, and I think that’s really important, where I always thought it was so funny that all of my patients that were athletes, they weren’t taking care of themselves to not be sick. They were taking care of themselves to be the healthiest they could be so they could perform their best. And I was like, “Okay, well, most of us aren’t performing on a field, but we are performing in life.” It would make a lot of logical sense that, that would go hand-in-hand.

SSR: Okay, so let’s go back to the social aspect too. So how do you think about that social, and you mentioned that there’s sometimes 10 more people, but I guess how have you grown that from club one to club four?

JL: I think really making sure people understand what we mean by social. I think there’s so many different ways to go about social wellness or social self-care where there’s things like a bathhouse that you could go share a space with 150 people and you’re meeting new people, where Remedy is more social for you and your party size. So I always say it’s like going to a restaurant or going to a bar. A bar, you’re going to go meet a bunch of people that you don’t know, but at a restaurant you’re going to be around a lot of people where you’re going to be sitting with your table. And you might meet people or say hi as you’re crossing paths, and I think that is really, people are going to go to whatever they’re more attracted to. I think there’s different moments, whether it’s certain things you’re celebrating or just different routines that maybe you want to be around a lot of people and some things that maybe you want to just be around who you go with.

And I think it would be interesting in the future, because I think there’s going to be so many ways to go about it. Everyone’s like, what’s the right way to do this? And I’m like, it’s saying what’s the right way to build a restaurant or a hotel? There’s going to be a million different ways to go about it and people are going to resonate with whatever environment, community, and level of hospitality that they are attracted to.

SSR: Is there one thing you rethought after watching people? Do you watch people in the space and figure out how they’re using it or does your team, and has there been one interesting solution that you found that you were surprised by?

JL: Listen, we’re analyzing and looking at it. Every day I walk in the club, I’m like, how do I make this better? Because I think forward-thinking and thinking about future clubs, it’s hard to just walk through a space once. But what will we do differently for the next time? I’m like, “No, no, no. I need to see this in a million different ways and a million different times and see and evolve.” I would say we’ve done everything with each club. The newest one looked at all the areas that could be enhanced. I think there’s a lot that I want to do in the future that is a little bit more confidential. For us, it’s have to constantly innovate and think ahead and you can’t just think about, what do you want to do next year? You have to think about what am I going to do in 2027 or 2028?

And some of these developments are so far out and I think it’s important for us, and I think that’s really one of our unique traits is that, I’ve been working on Remedy since 2012 and we’ve been running clubs since 2019, it’s not just about creating a cool company. There’s so much that goes into all the learnings that you figure out through that time. And I think that is really important, because sometimes you think you just go throw a bunch of things in the space and make it beautiful and it works, and it’s actually not that easy. It’s really hard. You get it. Brick and mortar business and construction and you build things out, there’s a mistake, it’s like you can’t just go tear down the walls and start that area again because it’s expensive, but it’s interesting.

And I think also when I’ve worked for different companies as a consultant and seen that when you’re building out a hotel or something that’s four or five, six years away and trying to think of, oh, this is what our wellness is going to be in four or five, six years, I’m like, “Oh, you really need to know. You to be in the industry to understand what it could be, and then hope to get really lucky.”

But I think it’s hard to innovate something if you don’t actually see it firsthand over and over again. And I think that is something that we’re really proud of because I think that helps us keep progressing.

SSR: Have you thought about going into hotels or partnering with hotel companies?

JL: For sure. I think we’ve talked. We’ve spoken with a lot of different hotels and eventually I want to create a Remedy Hotel. But I think, yeah, it’s just either time, place, opportunity hasn’t been a right match yet. I’m being really patient. I don’t want to just throw the Remedy Place brand on someone else’s concept. Right now my job is to protect the brand at all costs, meaning that I shouldn’t ever compromise what we should be doing. If we’re going to do a hotel, we’re going to go do it and I want to do it the right way and that’s definitely not going to be the most affordable way to do it. But I would never just make a not as nice Remedy just to be in a whole bunch of hotels. So stay tuned with that.

SSR: TBD. I guess, too, as you grow, outside of the Remedy Hotel, where do you see Remedy Place in the next five years and how do you hope to grow it?

JL: I think, one, we’re going to continue to grow the clubs. I don’t want hundreds of these. I want 15 clubs and I want to build residential towers and hotels. I think us getting into the product space, we’re releasing an ice bath in a couple of months with Kohler that we’ve been working on for about two and a half years. What we’re finding is we can’t be everywhere, but we could supply everywhere. And also working with a lot of these manufacturers and companies, you realize that either they’re not set up for scale or it’s not the white glove service. If you’re going to spend that six figures on a product for somebody, they’re expecting white glove service like they would get with any other six figure product that they’re buying. And I think there’s limitations there.

The companies to date of these big modalities, there’s a lot to take into consideration whether it’s like they look extremely medical. No one wants a crazy looking medical thing in their home or in their beautiful hotel. So there’s a lot that needs to happen there. And we just saw that, okay, we know how to design, we have a trusted brand, we have learned a lot and we know how to make a lot of these things way better. And now we’re just partnering with the top manufacturers to then create the best products. That way we can have a perfect compliment. I think, with Kohler, for example, I was never going to make the best ice bath in the world by myself. There’s a lot of money, there’s manufacturing, there’s engineering, there’s a lot that goes into that. But I knew what our strengths were and it was the perfect compliment.

I think two brands coming together and making something phenomenal. And I can confidently say that it is the best ice bath in the world because we looked at every ice bath. We had over 10 years of data of how to make each thing better. And it’s the Kohler name and the Kohler manufacturing and whether it’s warranties or customer service or installation, you can guarantee that their infrastructure is very different than anyone else out there. And we’re just really excited to have a partner like that, especially on a product like this.

SSR: Is there one thing that you always do as part of your wellness? You have all these tricks and tools at your fingertips? What’s your health and wellness ritual? Is there something that you do every day?

JL: We might need an eight-hour documentary for that, but I always say, because this is a common question, I always say the most important thing is my program and plan won’t work for everyone else. And I think the first thing that everyone can do is start to understand themselves. I always say your body’s your number one asset and most people don’t even know how it works, nevermind how to take care of it. So the first thing that everyone needs to do before they start anything is start learning about their body. It could be as simple as a wearable or it could be as complex as doing functional medicine on a regular basis and doing their full blood work. I like to do it all. I think whether it’s my blood work that I do every six months, whether it’s my wearable that’s on my arm that I’m tracking every day, whether it’s my mattress, whether it’s the quarterly test that I do in Remedy with my VO2 max to range of motion to all of cognitive function memory, that gives me a benchmark of how healthy I am, what are my areas of improvements.

And then also allowing me to set goals and parameters of what I need to focus on, because I use everything that’s in Remedy and that’s why they’re there, but how often in the frequency and how I change it always evolves and it should never be always the same. Because my stressors or my lifestyle or my travel schedule or the workload that I have, all of these things change. And I think I do weekly, monthly, and quarterly audits of my life, and then with my data figure out, all right, how do I create the next level of routines to make sure that I’m prepared? Because I know with working these 100 hour work weeks for now, my whole adult life I feel like I’ve worked around the clock, the only way I would be able to do that is if I was my healthiest self. And I think even at the most stressed moments of my life, I force myself to be the most healthy because that was the only way that I could successfully perform.

SSR: Yeah, makes sense. I guess there’s a lot of noise out there in the wellness space right now, so how do you all stay on top of what’s happening? And then also, how do you see it continuing to evolve? We talked about how it’s evolved the last couple of five, 10 years. How do you see the wellness space, especially where you’re playing and in hospitality changing or evolving, I hate using the word change, but evolving over the next five years?

JL: Listen, I think it’s going to become more and more social and I think it’s going to become more and more holistic. I think people don’t want to have to do medication if they don’t have to be. They don’t want to get surgery if they don’t have to. And I think the shift is going to be from the goal of not being sick and being preventative to thinking about health as a tool for your success. And I think that is really where we’re going to see health being integrated into every aspect of our life, whether it’s an actual modality or whether it’s something that we don’t even know is enhancing us while we’re experiencing or interacting with it. And in the hospitality space, there’s so much. If we went through my business extension ideas and all of these things that I would do for a hotel or for residences or anything, there’s so many opportunities right now.

Because everything can be done better and there’s a lot of things that also need a lot of correction, and I just think that the future is going to be health and AI. These are the two industries that are exploding because AI, whether you like it or hate it, it’s taking over and it’s going to keep evolving. And then health, I think that we’re going to be able to save a lot of people’s lives with advancements in AI and I think also within the education. I’m telling you that the biggest thing that I think is missing in our healthcare system is education, because people don’t know anything about their body or how to take care of it. AI is going to help make everything much more accessible. And that’s exciting for me because I think you don’t need to go to Remedy to be healthy. The foundational pillars of health are a lot simpler than we think, but people just don’t know them.

I do think it’s going to be really interesting. And I see already the science catching up on alternative medicine to show people, as a first line of intervention, why wouldn’t you try something alternative? It sounds so crazy to me now. When I was starting my program and everyone’s like, “Alternative medicine is fake doctors and they can’t fix anything and there’s no science,” sometimes in school I was so science-backed and I’ve always been, I’m like, “I don’t get how people can say there’s no science here because I’m seeing it work over and over again.” And I think it’s finally having a level of, not only awareness, but I think appreciation where more people are way more open to it. And I think once they’re open to it and then they’re like, “Oh wow, this works,” they’re like, “Why haven’t I done this?” That was the common story in my practice. People were like, “Why doesn’t everyone have someone like you?” Or, “Why have I never done this before?” And I’m like, “I don’t know. It just wasn’t how our healthcare system was trained.”

I think you go to medical school to study medicine. I learned a little bit about pharmacology, but I learned mostly about the body. And while they’re learning about biochemistry or pharmaceuticals, I was learning about biochemistry of nutrition. And I think, you think of the problems that we face on a day-to-day basis, they’re all mostly fixed through lifestyle changes and just learning how to be healthy. But I think what’s interesting is just, I used to have so many patients that would be so upset. They would have very amazing doctors all over the world and they would spend a lot and they’re like, “Well, why isn’t so-and-so telling me these things?” Or, “Why is this the first time I’m hearing it?” And I’m like, “Well, they weren’t trained. They didn’t go to school to learn how to make you healthy. They learned how to take care of you when you’re sick.”

And then I think the level set, I always say, if someone’s unhappy, it’s because expectations aren’t clear. And I was like, “So I think if you’re looking at how to be healthy, that’s where you need other health professionals to teach you that. Don’t come to me if you just got an accident or if there’s an emergency.” But I think there’s a lot of things that if there was an emergency after you do have that intervention that no matter what, you should always be at least co-managed with something alternative, even if you have to go the traditional route.

SSR: Yeah, that’s really interesting. And also, speaking of education, you guys have set up a framework which is an educational platform. Do you want to talk about that and how that speaks or helps continue your pillars of what you believe?

JL: Yeah. It’s something that will slowly build over time. I think for me what was really important is Remedy is a luxury experience and I’m like, how do we use the brand as a platform for education? And that’s the end goal is, how do I make this company as big as possible so that we can be the most trusted source that people can go to, to learn how to take care of themselves? And that’s where, do we do a blog? Do we do a podcast? And so many of these things are so crowded. I was like, listen, I want to just give people lessons or things to work on that they can apply anywhere no matter what they have access to or what their financial status is. And just really learning about how to change their thought process, how to analyze their environments, how to strengthen their relationships.

There’s so many things that aren’t traditional when people think about health and I think it’s a starting point that we kicked off last year, and it’s something that as we’re able to grow and invest more into it, it’s something that I’m really passionate about because, like I said, it’s just about education. Education’s what we need to, really. Every brand, every company, every platform, it’s just making sure that we’re sharing the right information. Because like you said earlier, there’s a lot of information out there and it’s crowded and it’s confusing and people don’t know what to trust. And when you’re in a vulnerable state and then you feel like I don’t know who to trust or what to read, it’s really complicated. And one person’s solution is not everyone’s solution.

And I think that’s the other thing that’s, probably, you’ll notice in the next five years, is everything needs to be individualized. Yes, there’s generic things that will help everyone, but when you’re on a specific program, whether it’s for your supplementation or your diet, what you should be doing for your self-care, there’s always things that are going to make you better, but if you’re going to put in the time or effort or the investment, you probably want to be as precise as possible to you.

SSR:  I guess my question is, with all the noise out there, besides coming to Remedy Place or your other things, how do you tell people, I guess what you said earlier, figure out, get a baseline for yourself? Somebody can be like, “Get mad, then you need this supplement or this supplement. Why aren’t you taking magnesium?” There’s always something out there that people are saying. But I guess, to your point, just come and get a baseline and figure out what’s best for you.

JL: Just learn and listen to your body. The healthier that you become, the more your body tells you. It gives you signs for what you need to do. If you’re eating something and you’re always bloated, it’s probably something that’s causing a little inflammation while you’re eating. If you feel lethargic after your meal, probably something also that is causing inflammation that’s working against you. I think also it’s even when someone’s in pain, usually people just ignore it or they don’t focus on it. Oh, it just will go away. And I’m like, pain, your body can always get in a pain-free position, but then you’re going to be in all these antalgic positions that then you start having a pain somewhere else. And I’m like, “Just pay attention and be proactive and try to be inquisitive and learn.”

SSR: Speaking of learning, what has been your biggest takeaway or lesson learned since you’ve started Remedy Place?

JL: Wow. I think a couple of things. I think in the beginning it was always be okay with being misunderstood because everything that we were doing wasn’t traditional. And if I did listen to other people, I probably wouldn’t have done a lot of the things that I did, which wouldn’t have made Remedy as special. And then I think the other lesson that obviously any entrepreneur or anyone that’s opening brick and mortar, it’s challenging. There’s a lot of resistance and learning to be uncomfortable and look at it as a positive because when you’re uncomfortable or you have to overcome your environment, you have to change and you have to evolve. And I think the best part about Remedy is, not only is it my passion and what I love and that it helps people, but it’s continually pushing me professionally and personally to adapt and learn how to thrive in different scenarios and different challenges.

So I think I’m so grateful because it allows me to grow as a human. And I just turned 35 this year and to be able to have something that constantly challenges you, to have constant things to learn from and to add more and more tools to your tool belt, it’s the coolest gift that you could ever ask for. And I think you could always look at it as, oh my God, it’s terrible, it’s so stressful. Or how do you do that? Or you’re like, no, this is actually helping me develop and, while I’m here in this lifetime, I want to be the best version that I can be. And I think you only fail if you give up so just keep going and try to do your best. And that’s it.

SSR: . It’s a great place to stop, but I also was curious, too, you were in practice and now that you’ve taken yourself probably out of that, so people can’t come to you, they can come to you, but you’re not the main person that is seeing patients, a, do you miss that? And B, how do you hire you, you know what I mean? Or hire for or other versions of you to make sure everyone’s getting the best treatment? Because that must be a huge part of your process.

JL: Yeah, I think to start, what I realized in practice was no matter how long my wait list was or how many people I tried to squeeze in each week, there was a limitation. And my dream was to leave a much bigger impact than just help X amount of people per year. The dream was always, I want to change globally how we approach our health. And one of my patients, a lot of my patients became my mentors, but it was a year in and she was like, “Jon, you have such a big vision, but how are you going to change healthcare if you’re only seeing one patient at a time?” And that really stuck with me. And I think when I opened Remedy to Transition, I tried to still see patients while building the business. I could be on an investment call or doing a design or handling something internally with the team and then be with the patient and then have to go back to marketing or PR.

Coming in and out of being in the zone of treating a patient and then work mode, the guests would never know, but I didn’t feel like I was being as present. And then I’m on a plane every week, so if someone really needed me to do a full rehab program, I wasn’t the most reliant because I didn’t even know my schedule. So one, I miss it so much, and when I do get to work with patients or I am doing, I still do favors for close friends or someone that it happens and I’m like, wow, you missed the instant gratification of seeing how much you can help somebody in the moment. And with Remedy, I just hear about it and I see it and I see the movement happening and I have to trust it, but I’m not sitting there and having an emotional cry with a patient that’s finally better. Sometimes I do miss it a lot, but I think for the greater good and for the bigger mission, Remedy is going to allow me to do a lot more impact than just my private practice.

And then, for the doctors, I think everyone has their own special niche, and I think for us it’s important that their skillset and they’re highly educated and they’re good at their craft, but it’s also about allowing everyone else to have their moment to shine with their uniqueness and personality. And I think there’s not one way to treat everybody, so having a wide array of different doctors that have different thought processes is always great to add more and more of them to the team, and that’s something that we really are going to lean even more into in the future.

SSR: Well, amazing. Thank you so much for taking the time to speak with us today. I can’t wait to see as you continue to evolve and create more clubs.

JL: Well, I really appreciate it and thank you for the opportunity.